pNode Staking Mechanism

Thank you!

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So at 31:27 of the podcast, Andrey states that basically the pnode borrows 1750 prv from staking pool.

Thus requiring that the reward be split between pnode owner and the stake pool until 1750 is accrued and paid back…and then the owner is now rewarded 100%

i thought i read somewhere that the percentages are locked in forever no matter how much the pnode eventually accrues.

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Do you mean the percent you earn if you are borrowing the prv to stake your node is locked in until manually staking your own coins?

I know between 13:30 and 15:00 he talks about not needing more than 1750 to stake either a vnode or a pNode.

If you choose to stake your own 1750 prv then you will receive 100% of the reward.

Hey @K_Mueller,
good point!

Thanks for highlighting it. I haven’t explained it well during the podcast :sweat_smile:

The true is that pNode can earning PRV and keep splitting reward until it earned enough to stake.

Sorry for confusing.

@andrey @jared @Kelsomatic @K_Mueller

The truth is, the funded stake is rented.
This means the Node (fka pNode) earnings are split 35/65 (at the time of writing), until you stop using the funded stake and start using your own PRV to stake the Node.

Funded stake is NOT a loan

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@Jamie

So…Andrey in the post above states “…keep splitting reward until it earned enough to stake.”

You say “the funded stake is rented” and you will never get 100% until 1750 is fully funded.

If the latter is true, will there be a proposal for such? Akin to “rent to own” or pay off loan? Think its a decent idea.

Not sure how that works in the overall framework of incognito but nonetheless.

Not likely. That is how it started off, and is what is causing the confusion, but it was changed shortly after. That said, never say never.

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I like the idea of pnode rewards being used to essentially pay off the 1750 prv only if it doesn’t throw a wrench in the inner-workings and plans.

If not, then there are multiple ideas: incentive based percentage increase from the initial 35%, etc if milestones are met coordinated with badges gained, etc. Or every year the pnode is online and running one is rewarded with percentile gain…and coupled with the split reward, one could pay their pnode off.

Either way…I will eventually fund my pnode…

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i believe FUNDED STAKING is the great idea of this blockchain (and others offcourse).
Imagine if we gonna have a higher price for PRV after that will become difficult for the average guy to buy 1750 PRV. The other blockchains offers dPOs so you can delegate to someone bigger to earn rewards BUT in my opinion that doesn t help decentralization as there are actually less validator for the network but bigger. Here on INCOGNITO we have the possibility to grow steady with also small investor because also if the PRV price will rise, and thats good for the community, investors and who believe and want to partecipate in the project can still own a piece of the blockchain using borrowed FUNDs to earn rewards and then when the debts is repaid he could run his own node receiving 100% rewards. All this will help SECURE the network much more than many other blockchains out there.

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Funded is not the same as borrowed. There is no payback. Your node earnings are split 35/65 (35% for you, 65% for the fund) as long as you use it.

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Yeah but after i mean. Let’s make an example:
PRV reach 3$ and to buy my own staking node i would need 3$x1750 + hardware cost(most users can t afford that) so maybe they could buy 3-4 FUNDED nodes earning 35% out of 100% and when the user reach 1750 PRV he could stake those on one of those node?
Am i right? That’s what i understood
In this way the users can earn and secure the network without spending so much money buying coins!

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I was a little irritated that the funded pnode wasn’t clear as Andrey in a podcast had verbally said that we could pay off our pnode once it reached 1750 prv. Then they said that was false.

And more so irritated that it was not clear from the get go what was what…that one could even pay their node off when prv was super cheap…I find it disingenuous at best that information wasn’t readily put out and it feels as it was done so to make where very few could unstake…and this incognito forever receives 65%…with no recourse other pay $1750 if not more.

The percentages should be 65% going to us and 35% to incognito since they were so unclear in the beginning.

I was all about this project early on and nowhere did I see any mention about unsealing when prv was cheap. Terrible.

Funding to stake any node on the network requires 1750 PRV. When you bought a node, the 1750 PRV is not given to you for free. The incognito team gives you the ability to gain a percentage of the returns because you bought the product. Essentially, when you bought in, they took care of the funding. Normally you wouldn’t be able to receive the kind of returns your receiving without staking. When you bought the node, you paid a premium to receive a higher return then normal. Not to mention your also paying to get the hardware needed to host a node (otherwise you would have to host it on your own server).

Your not paying the node off, the node is yours, you already bought it. Staking 1750 PRV would mean your actually funding the staking yourself. This would be instead of using incognitos own money, meaning you get the full returns instead of just a percentage. This is a completely fair system. As for when PRV was super cheap, the staking amount was never fixed to a dollar amount. It has always been 1750 PRV no matter the price fluctuations of PRV. This was quite clear.

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I think we have been pretty transparent about every function, when it came available.
Andrey wasn’t aware of the funded staking at the time of the conversation. It was corrected afterwards. The feature to unstake a pNode was not present from the start. The devs added that in later when people started asking for the option to do so.

There is no intention of hiding of information. We are constantly adapting, which can result in people missing some updates and with that the availability of some features.

To keep that to a minimum we have added the “news” function in the app, did you notice the pushpin at the top right?

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Unfortunately I don’t have the capital to start staking for a vNode, I guess I could buy a node from incognto, but i’m waiting for the Node Tree to come out. I do have a bunch of unoccupied servers laying around that have no use. I would like to host nodes on them, but i’m lacking the funds. Since incognito supplements the staking fee for purchased nodes, I was wondering if it would be possible for incognito to supplement the staking fee for some vNode’s. The rates could be the same or less then current physical nodes (35% | 65%). It would definitely lead to the addition of many more nodes which would be a net benefit. I was just curious if this is an option worth exploring.

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Oh I get it. I get the process, the protocol, and everything about it.

Early on there was not one word about unstaking and what that meant aka 100% rewards…it was just plug and play.

If we the people would have known that…I for sure would have paid that amount of 1750 prv when prv was sub $0.30…I could have with the information…unstaked my 3 nodes for a mere $1600…now that doesn’t even unstake 1 of 3 nodes which is good in a sense considering it’s going up.

Maybe it wasn’t done on purpose but there was very little info out there floating in the cosmos other plug this up and earn prv.

And that’s my point

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Anyway guys, INCOGNITO is the only chain to do this FUNDED staking. Nobody else thought about this and i think it will be really a nice things for the network decentralization. We could have like this a really decentralized network because small users gonna be able to secure the network and earn also without staking\buying own PRV. I think this is an amazing feauture for INCOGNITO. I really love this idea.

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Yes, I understand. My point was, in a year from now we can have features that we have no idea about today. Once they are implemented we would have loved to have known about it today. Do you get what I mean?

The initial idea for pNodes was, plug it in and let it be. It was meant to be a way to give the mass an easy way to get to know the crypto world, and a way to expand our network beyond the crypto communities that are already familiar with crypto. There are more people not using crypto than people who are using crypto.

That didn’t pan out the way it was planned. Instead of just letting it be, people wanted way more info, access, options and so on. We adapted to most of them already by now. These options were not all planned, but came up when people started using the pNodes. We can’t communicate what we don’t know.

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